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  • Andrew Simpson

#078 How To Fix… Part 1

In this first episode in this series How to Fix… we will focus on the long answer to questions people most commonly have on cloth nappies. We will also be joined each time by Jenna, who is looking after her 2nd son in cloth nappies. Jenna will keep us up to date in new things she has discovered during her second cloth nappy journey.

In this show, we explore the following questions.

How to fix stains

How to fix Nappy Rash

How to fix Nappies that have mold

How to fix people telling you how to do everything



Transcription: How To Fix… Part 1

Andrew: Welcome to Nappy Leaks with Vicki Simpson and Vashti Wadwell. How are you, Vashti?

Vashti: Good thanks Andrew, how are you?

Andrew: Good. Just remembered where I was for a second. How are you going, Vicki?

Vicki: I’m good. How are you?

Andrew: I’m fine. And we have a guest.

Vashti: Woo hoo.

Andrew: Hey, Jenna.

Jenna: Who has started the podcast by eating, again. Hi, Andrew.

Andrew: Jenna is just one month back from maternity leave. What’s it like to be back at work, Jenna?

Jenna: I don’t know, because it’s definitely not being recorded before I’m back from maternity leave.

Vicki: You’re supposed to say, it was like I never left.

Jenna: It was like I’d never left. It’s really nice, I can be away from my children, they’re driving me insane. No, I don’t know. To be honest, I’m looking forward to missing my kids. I’m looking forward to getting a break and missing my kids. I’m really, really excited for my husband. He’s on fulltime paternity leave for three months and he will love it. He’s going to absolutely love having that time with the boys. I can tell. I can update you in real life and tell you how it is later. I’ve got no idea, is the answer.

Andrew: Check socials for the latest information on that.

Vicki: We’ll put it in the show notes.

Jenna: Real update. I’m sure if you’re in the Bubblebubs VIP group you will know that by now. I was in a nail group, a cricket group the other day and I commented on something. And someone was like, oh Jenna, I know you from cloth nappies. And I was like, hi. And I found Chantelle Prout, a couple of people, big overlap, mum, hubbies and stuff. And I was like oh, hey, when did you turn up?

Vicki: Yeah, I found people in the 4074 group when I’ve said something that wasn’t quite as PC as I would say anywhere else. And I’m like…

Jenna: When I went to go for my son’s kindy interview, and check it out, I mentioned I work for a cloth nappy company, and keeping in mind Vicki’s kids are 15, 16, what’s Gabe, 8?

Andrew: Gabe’s 8 yeah. Actually he’ll be 9 when this comes out.

Jenna: Nine when this comes out. So I’m there, and I said I work for a cloth nappy company, and she kind of looked, there was a woman who used to make cloth nappies whose kids came here, and I was like Vicki Simpson? And she was like, yes, how are they? Knew all the kids names, knew Vicki, knew everything, was really excited to know that the company was bigger now, that you had employees and it was growing like that.

Vicki: That was never Angela?

Jenna: No, no, no, no, no, kindy. Ryan’s going to kindy next year.

Vicki: So you mean you mean you had an interview with Laura?

Jenna: No, it wasn’t Laura Ross, be he is going with Laura Ross next year.

Vicki: He will love her.

Jenna: She is absolutely lovely. It wasn’t her, it was the woman, the big person who runs the place.

Vicki: Oh yeah, yeah.

Jenna: Manager, that’s the word I’m after. And yeah, she remembered you, and she was talking about how lovely you are.

Vicki: Yeah, I was thinking, your kids didn’t go to the same day care as me and not even thinking kindy. Wow.

Jenna: Ryan’s four next year. He’s closer to four than three at this point. So yeah…

Andrew: Just in case [inaudible 03:03]

Vicki: No, he’s already four.

Jenna: He’s already four, yes, he is.

Vicki: He’s already started kindy with Laura and loves her.

Jenna: There’s a podcast I listen to and they were pre-recording their mini episodes before they went on tour. And they were like, we’ve just got back from Europe. It was wonderful, or terrible, or Stephen, just put together the words we need. And I want to see comment in your review, or wherever we post this, if you know what podcast they’re telling Stephen what to do, and they’re bossing Stephen around. If you know that podcast, I want you to comment, because I want to see what overlap we have. I’m very curious now.

Andrew: Just in case you’re wondering…

Jenna: This is Nappy Leaks.

Andrew: …they weren’t a sponsor. That wasn’t a sponsor spot, they’re just gushing. So today’s subject is how to fix… that should be really, duh, daah.

Vicki: How to fix a nappy with an internal snap. I just did that, literally, while we were chatting. You have to unpick it.

Andrew: If this was a video podcast, that would be excellent.

Vicki: I know, you have to unpick it…

Jenna: A video podcast, is that a thing? Isn’t that just like a vlog then?

Andrew: No, you can do video podcasts. But you’ve got to have the right app. I discovered recently that not every app is able to play video podcasts. You’ve got to have the right app to play video podcasts.

Vicki: I’m in a relatively good mood. My serotonin levels are quite high today.

Jenna: Yeah, you seem in a really good mood.

Andrew: I didn’t know your Apple watch could tell you your serotonin levels?

Vicki: My Apple watch seems to have lost a link. I can’t get it on.

Jenna: My Apple watch is lovely.

Vashti: I left my Apple watch at home.

Jenna: My Apple watch is beautiful and Ryan really likes to do the thing where you get the water drop out of it, and he thinks all watches to that now. So Casey got out the shower the other day, and he’s like, Daddy, can I do the water drop thing on your watch?

Vicki: What’s the water drop?

Jenna: When you get in a pool and you’re meant to roll the thing and it makes a noise and it gets the water out. I don’t know if it’s a placebo or not.

Andrew: No, it’s a real thing, because I’m being an Apple nerd…

Jenna: Vicki’s clearly not.

Vicki: I don’t wear it in the shower.

Andrew: …where the speakers are in the watch, they’re actually recessed, so when you’re swimming, those areas fill up with water…

Jenna: Let me do it [beeps].

Andrew: …so the idea of…

Jenna: It makes that noise.

Andrew: …the idea of it making that noise is it pushes the water out of the speaker thing so the speakers work properly.

Jenna: But yeah, Casey got out of the shower the other day with his normal watch on, and Ryan wanted to do that, because he thinks all watches do that.

Andrew: So really he just pushed it forward an hour.

Jenna: Yes, he had to explain to him that Mummy’s watch isn’t like every watch.

Andrew: So how about you start with the first subject.

Jenna: That’s a great idea. How to fix stains.

Vicki: You can answer that.

Jenna: So I broke it down into three topics. Newborn poo, some kids are just stainy. Some kids come out and it depends on the milk, depends on the baby, depends on…

Vicki: How their liver processes too, because the bilirubin is what’s staining.

Jenna: Exactly. The bilirubin is what’s staining. And I was either in a cloth group, or a customer or something, who had a twin, and one stained and one didn’t. Really weird. So some kids are just stainy. Most breastfed kids, I’m not 100% on formula, is formula the same?

Vicki: Apparently it’s like peanut butter.

Vashti: Formula has more, higher iron, so the iron will actually stain as well.

Jenna: So you should be rinsing formula? Or can you throw it in the wash?

Vashti: No, formula fed poo needs to be gotten off. It’s not as water soluble as breastfed poo.

Jenna: Interesting.

Vicki: Yeah, I saw someone say that it was like peanut butter, but because I don’t have personal experience…

Jenna: I was going to say, I’ve actually washed friends’ nappies and all of those were breastfed as well, so I’m not sure.

Vashti: No, your formula fed poo really needs to come off before you put it in the wash. Don’t put it through the washing machine.

Jenna: Breastfed poo can just be thrown through the washing machine with some kids. I was lucky, R… what’s his name?

Vicki: Liam.

Jenna: That one.

Vashti: The other one.

Jenna: The other one.

Andrew: Why don’t you just call them number one and number two?

Vicki: Yeah, I do.

Jenna: I usually call him, not-Ryan is his name a lot, or The Other One. Poor thing.

Vicki: He’s a second child. He’s normal.

Vashti: Wait until you have the third one.

Jenna: [beep] [laughter] Andrew, you might need to beep that. I’m assuming you just heard a very loud beep and I’m very sorry for that. Let’s just say that I was not expression enthusiasm about the idea of a third child.

Vicki: You’re setting him up to be a middle child though.

Jenna: No, no, he can just be a second ignored kid, that’s fine.

Andrew: I was going to say, you’d better start saving now for therapy.

Jenna: All the kids need therapy funds. Anyway, I’ve been lucky with him, I was able to throw his poo into his, before-he-had-solids poo into the washing machine and it came out just fine. Some kids have really stainy poo. In that situation, you want like a Sard or a Sunlight soap. So rinse off and then rub a little bit with that. Or easier, a stain remover spray. Choice recently did a comparison of most of the big stain remover sprays, and they all came out about the same, so whichever one floats your boat.

Andrew: Whichever one you like the picture of on the front.

Jenna: For me, I like the Sard one, because the Sard one, if you turn it one way does a little squirt, and if you do it another way, does more of a spray. I like that feature on it.

Vicki: Don’t you just like, as soon as you kind of hit your mid twenties and you get married and have kids, you know, this is your life now. You actually go to the supermarket and you buy, based on the way it squirts.

Jenna: Yes, yes, the way a bottle squirts. Like this is my life now. I’m really curios to know how many people heard that went that’s interesting, and how many people, oh for God’s sake.

Andrew: I feel there’s something I have to beep there, but there’s nothing.

Vicki: I’m actually not being vulgar at all, and it was not…

Vashti: Go the show where Andrew and my brains go, we went straight to the dirty.

Jenna: I didn’t at all.

Vicki: But just the life change.

Jenna: And I said it purely because I have a bottle of the pink on, the Vanish one at the moment, and I don’t love it, because it squirts weird. And I also definitely used carpet stain remover on a nappy the other day, because they looked very similar in the same bottle, it worked. Whatever. I’m sorry, it’s the same kind of label.

Vashti: I’m pretty sure they’re all the same.

Jenna: I’m sure it’s the same thing with a different label. OK, so that’s the best way to deal with newborn stuff if you have a stainy newborn. Older poos, it can just be a sign that something is off in your routine. So agitation, meaning your machine isn’t loaded correctly. And you might want to check your routine. You might want more heat, better detergent, more detergent. Asterisk here, the exceptions will be blueberries, bananas, Panatol [sic]. Panatol?

Vicki: Panadol.

Vashti: Panadol [unison].

Jenna: Thank you. That’s the big ones that do staining.

Vashti: They leave that grey-purply stain in your nappy.

Jenna: And it’s the Sorbitol?

Vicki: Yeah, Sorbitol.

Vashti: And Sorbitol is a synthetic version of the natural ingredients in blueberries and banana.

Jenna: Oh, interesting, I did not know that. So coming into, I saw someone in a cloth nappy group the other day post, oh God, it’s blueberry season. So I think we all know what that means.

Vicki: It’s always blueberry season for Gabriel. There are times when I feel I need to take out a second mortgage.

Jenna: I’m not going to lie, we have a blueberry tree, send him over, our blueberry tree is going off.

Vicki: It’s a bush.

Jenna: Blueberry bush. It’s going off, and we have so many at the moment.

Vicki: He’ll just sit there. He will eat them all. I promise you, he will come over. He will come home with a belly ache.

Jenna: A game we played the other day, it’s one of those Dad games where it’s not overly thought through, it’s just simple and fun. We filled the kiddy pool, the splash pool. Put the kids in and Casey gets a punnet of blueberries and dumps it in the pool.

Vashti: Nice.

Jenna: And you know what? They think it’s the best game ever. Rill thinks that’s how you eat blueberries. She actually doesn’t eat them any other time apparently, except for when we play that game. And then the best part is, you have a good 20 minutes you can sit and have a cup of coffee and have a conversation. Any other comments on stains? Stains anyone, stains? I think we’ve covered that.

Vicki: No, you’re the stain guru.

Jenna: Andrew, hit us with the next one.

Andrew: Nappy rash. Oh actually, sorry let me say it properly. How to fix… nappy rash.

Vicki: Nappy rash is caused because you’ve left the nappy on too long, generally. Or your baby has really acidic poo.

Jenna: Which brings me to my first question I ask anyone who mentions nappy rash to me, and I don’t know how to word this nicer, but in the but crack, or on the cheeks? Because that is two entirely different things.

Vicki: Two entirely different things.

Jenna: Because Ryan was always in the butt crack, he had really acidic poo.

Vicki: Acidic poo, yeah. And it happens in both disposables and cloth. And essentially, it is ammonia burning your bub.

Jenna: I had to use nappy cream on him every change until he toilet trained, and sorry for the TMI, but to this day, if he has a runny poo, he’ll run to me and ask me to put nappy cream on him still. It’s just his body. So that’s the first thing you need to check is, is it the kid, is it the nappy? And then if it is on the cheeks, sometimes it’s just leaving the nappy on too long, as Vicki said.

Vicki: It can also be a reaction to the fabrics. That actually does happen.

Jenna: We had a weird one with the Pebbles that time.

Vicki: Yeah, some babies do actually react to natural fibres, some react to synthetic fibres. Some react to disposables. They’re all very rare, but possible.

Vashti: Michaela was allergic to disposables, so she had massive nappy rash to the point where she had huge blisters. By six weeks we’d worked out it was the disposables, which we were only using part time. So she went fulltime cloth from six weeks. Kylan, on the other hand, whenever he was teething, we had to put him in natural fibres, because he’d have a reaction to synthetic fibres.

Jenna: And that’s the thing, some kids react to the wetness, so you need microfleece and more synthetics, but some kids are the opposite. So it really is a matter of picking, which I’ll also say. If you’re having trouble and you feel like your nappy cream isn’t working particularly well, try a couple. Because a lot of people swear by Sudocream. It never worked on mine. Bepanthen worked every time.

Vicki: See, it’s a barrier. It’s not actually a soother.

Vashti: See, that was the other thing, it didn’t matter what cream on or off the market. We even used natural beeswax on Michaela’s bum, she reacted to creams. So we could only use cloth wipes and plain water on her bum.

Jenna: I forgot Ryan’s cloth wipes for day care once, and I went and picked him up, his bum was bleeding from using disposable wipes for the day. Apparently Andrew wants me to talk into the microphone.

Vashti: Yeah. When Michaela was in day care, if one of the floaters was through the room and changing her bum through lunch and they used a disposable wipe…

Vicki: Are you talking about a person or a poo?

Jenna: A floater?

Vashti: A floater, OK, floaters are those ones that come in and cover lunch breaks.

Vicki: OK.

Vashti: So the person that was coming in, if they changed her nappy, and used a disposable wipe, then she would break out in a rash. And of course, they’d go and put cream on her bum, even though we weren’t supplying it, and it would make it even worse. So then we’d have to go through 48, 72 hours of intensive nappy free time, and lots of water. The other thing I did was…

Andrew: Here’s a silly question. If there’s a rash, people do wash the area first before they put nappy cream on, don’t they?

Vashti: I hope so.

Jenna: Actually, this is my top tip, that I got told once and I feel like isn’t spread enough, is yes, wash the area, get it really, really clean. But then get it dry.

Vicki: Dry it.

Jenna: I’m graphic here, but blow on their little bottoms. Ryan thought it was hilarious, every time I did it. Like if wet the bottom from cleaning it…

Vicki: I won’t tell you why.

Jenna: If you wet it from cleaning it, and then you add a barrier cream on it, all you’re doing is trapping the moisture. It’s literally what moisturiser does. Like, that is not what we want to do. So you want to dry it out really, really well and then put it in.

Vashti: Lots of nappy free time. But chamomile tea, brew up a pot of chamomile tea and wash their bum in chamomile tea, because it’s really, really soothing.

Jenna: And there is also some over the counter stuff you can get that has, it’s got a steroid and a something. It doesn’t have to be quite fungal yet, but if they’ve got a bad nappy rash, it will help improve it. Use it just for a couple of days. But obviously talk to a chemist, talk to a doctor, but that really helped me with what’s-his-doodle.

Andrew: Is there a chamomile tea wipe yet?

Vashti: No, not that I’ve seen.

Andrew: There you go, there’s a marketing idea. Somebody come up with a chamomile tea wipe. Make a million.

Jenna: I’m sure it exists. I don’t think you’re asking the right demographic if you’re asking about what disposable wipes are available. This demographic probably doesn’t know. The one thing I will say here while we’re on nappy rash…

Vicki: Actually there’s silk liners too. Silk liners really help.

Jenna: Some kids do really well with those.

Vicki: Yeah, raw silk liners have got lots of…

Vashti: And you can use, you don’t need to get expensive ones, you can just go to the local op shop and get some old scarves or an old sari skirt or something like that. Cut it up, serge the edges…

Jenna: That’s a great idea.

Vashti: …and lay that in your nappy.

Andrew: What’s serge the edges?

Vicki: That’s such an American term.

Vashti: Sorry.

Vicki: Overlock.

Vashti: Overlock the edges.

Jenna: I just went, sewing thing, don’t know.

Vicki: No, they’re called sergers in America and they’re called overlockers here.

Jenna: Oh look, it was a sewing thing I did know. My very, very small knowledge.

Vicki: It may even be in Europe too, I don’t know what they call them over there, but we call them overlockers here.

Jenna: The other thing to also remember with nappy rash, if you’re trying all these things and you’re not noticing anything, or if you’re having smells, you might want to check your wash routine. You might have ammonia in your nappies if they’re smelling very barnyardy after they’ve been peed in and stuff. You might need again…

Vicki: A tweak.

Jenna: …check agitation, heat, detergent. Check those things. You might need a tweak. There might be a kid getting ammonia burn. Look up ammonia burn, see what that looks like, and see if it looks like your nappy rash. That can be another thing that it can be.

Andrew: Look up ammonia burn and see if there’s a picture of your nappy there. Did we cover that one? Got everything?

Vicki: If you’re really I doubt, you can always get in contact with us. I know Bubblebubs customer service will happily, Jenna will happily answer your questions.

Jenna: I messaged Amy White once because Ryan had nappy rash…

Vicki: Amy is amazing.

Jenna: And she had mentioned something about her kid having it. And I was like, he has this weird heat rash. And I sent her, and I was like, sorry, sent her a picture of Ryan’s areas. And it wasn’t heat rash, he has hand, foot and mouth. And I had no idea. And by the way, I’d had a playdate that day and the other mum thought it was hand foot and mouth as well. Thought it was heat rash as well, so we were like, let’s keep him nappy free all day. So he was nappy free all day, spreading his hand, foot and mouth to them. In my defence, he had it neither on his hand, or his foot, or his mouth. It was literally just on his bum. So things can, nappy rash can be…

Vicki: That’s why it’s important to consult.

Jenna: Talk to someone.

Vicki: I remember going to the chemist and actually getting you, when Gabe had the staff infection. And I got you to take a picture. I said, please cover his important bits, send me a picture of the rash so I could actually show the chemist. And he said, he needs to consult a doctor.

Jenna: And sometimes it is, usually it’s not, but there’s always going to be the exception to the rule. My stupid husband had a rash on his back he kept ignoring. He looked at me. I google imaged a bunch of rashes, and I was like, I think you’ve got shingles, but that sounds stupid. Guess what? The man had shingles. He was away from his family five days a week, incredibly stressed at work, and stressed himself into two cases of shingles within three months or something like that. Google can be helpful.

Vicki: I’m surprised he wasn’t in pain.

Jenna: He was. He’s an idiot.

Vashti: Casey, you’re not listening to this, are you?

Jenna: I love him very much. He’s kind of a moron. My family was like, complain and tell us your problems. His family is like, just deal with it and keep moving on. And that’s how he had shingles without realising it. The point being, Google can be helpful. But ask someone.

Vicki: But do you know how many brain tumours I’ve had though?

Jenna: So many. You know what, look at Google and just ignore anything that says cancer. Just take off the cream on the top and look at the other stuff. But you know what? We didn’t diagnose the shingles. I then said maybe you should go to a doctor, I don’t think it’s just a weird rash. Like go to a doctor.

Andrew: We got plenty of scans to show that Vicki doesn’t have a tumour.

Vicki: Yes, I’ve had many MRIs.

Jenna: Me too, because I was, I used to get really, really bad migraines and stuff. So they were like, let’s just double check.

Andrew: OK, so I’ll ask the question again. Have we covered nappy rash?

Jenna: Take two, yes.

Andrew: OK, no worries. So the next one is, how to fix nappies that have mould on them.

Jenna: Don’t throw them.

Vashti: They can so be fixed. Give them a really good strip and a sanitise, get rid of, kill the mould.

Andrew: Oh, we’ve got an episode on that.

Vashti: We do have an episode on that.

Andrew: It was a lot simpler than I thought it was.

Vashti: It is so simple. You don’t need a science degree to do it. It’s really, really easy.

Andrew: Don’t forget, it was done by somebody who has a science degree.

Vashti: That’s true, but she’s done all the hard work. Amy from Cloth Nappy Hire Australia has done all the hard work for you. You just need to give them a really, really good deep clean to kill the mould, and make sure you use the bleach to actually kill it. You’ll still end up with stains. Mould does stain, and the stains are harder to get rid of, but you can use your stain removers and stuff. But go back, have a listen to the episode we did with Amy.

Andrew: And don’t forget, if you’re looking to rent nappies, go see Amy.

Vashti: Definitely. Amy’s packages are amazing.

Andrew: What’s her website again?

Vashti: Cloth Nappy Hire Australia.

Andrew: There we go… dot

Vashti: I think so.

Andrew: Maybe have to Google it.

Vashti: Google Cloth Nappy Hire Australia. She’s based in Brisbane. Jenna’s going to Google it now. We’ve linked her in our notes before. We’ll pop a link in there today as well.

Andrew: Go listen to her for a second.

Jenna: Her website is but if you Google Cloth Nappy Hire Australia, she is the first result.

Andrew: Because she’s the best?

Vashti: She is.

Jenna: Obviously. But yes, don’t throw them. I had a friend, she told me she had mould on her nappies. And I was like, I can save… she’d already thrown them away.

Andrew: Oh, no.

Jenna: So I went around, I was the nappy fairy and gave her, this may shock you, but I have a fairly large stash of nappies.

Andrew: Really?

Jenna: I know, shocking. So I went over and gave her 20 nappies that day. I was like here, you can get back in cloth. But I was like, I could have saved them, why did you do that? But she’s using cloth part time and has four kids, and is a doctor who works one day a week. By the way, she home schools as well. She’s basically a saint. She is the best person I know, and doesn’t listen to this podcast.

Andrew: How many of her kids are in nappies?

Jenna: Only one now. I think she’s only had one at a time, maybe Hamish and Benjy had a little overlap. Pretty much…

Andrew: What’s her hobby?

Jenna: Hobby? Trying to stay alive.

Vicki: Yeah, but I bet if you asked her to do something, she’d do it. Because you ask a busy person…

Jenna: She is the kindest, you know what, she had three kids. When we went to Europe, she turned up with soup so we had something in the freezer when we got back. She is the, honestly, one of the best people I know. She is the kindest, most wonderful person. And she’s a doctor, so I called her a little while ago to ask her something. She’s happy to like, and she’s a doctor and a mum of four, so she gives you…

Vashti: Real advice.

Jenna: …real advice. Like, this is what it says on the papers. This is what’s practical in real life.

Vicki: And this is what I think one of my children had at some stage.

Jenna: Exactly. She knows fricken everything…

Vicki: Except the names of her kids.

Jenna: She’s smart, but also like really nice and kind.

Vicki: You mean, not arrogant.

Jenna: Yeah, I hate her a little bit. No, she is the most lovely person in the world, truly she is.

Vashti: I feel that way about Eva from Seedling Baby.

Vicki: Yeah, I was thinking, this just sounds like Eva. She’s amazing.

Vashti: Eva’s got six kids, she home schools, her partners is in the services, so he works away a lot.

Vicki: She was part time running a pub, and a nappy business.

Vashti: Well they bought a pub when they moved to Wagga, and completely renovated it and redid it, and really built it back up. She was a distributor for UK Nappy Brand, Close, and she owned Seedling Baby here in Australia.

Jenna: How is she alive?

Vicki: And she did cloth, 100%.

Vashti: She is incredible. She is my hero.

Andrew: What’s her hobby? Oh, she doesn’t have one.

Jenna: Staying alive.

Vashti: Well, she does love her essential oils. And she gardens. They’ve got their own veggie garden.

Jenna: Bec has this amazing cottage garden she’s building out the front. Actually, I forgot the best thing. If you need a place to have an emotional breakdown, her house is very good. I have had more than one emotional breakdown in her house. I just had a huge fight with Case and needed to get out one night, and she was awake. Went over, and I’m like sobbing on her couch. Her husband walks out from putting the kids down, just looks at me and goes, I’ll get the ice cream. Picks up keys and walks out the door. Nick is the most well trained. He’s so sweet, and he’s very much like Casey. He actually sat and gave me advice from Casey’s angle as well. As far as recommendations go, if you need somewhere to have an emotional breakdown, I highly recommend the Coots. Good ice cream, good advice.

Vicki: So she’s going to have all these strangers knocking on her door. I need to have an emotional breakdown.

Jenna: And you know what? Bec would be like, please come in. she’s lovely. I’m going to have to tell her to listen to the podcast now.

Andrew: She’s got two doorbells. Come for a visit, emotional breakdown. Back onto the…

Jenna: Oh, nappies, you want to stop one of those.

Andrew: Yeah, back onto nappies. You haven’t actually said how you fix mould yet.

Vashti: She did, sanitise, bleach.

Jenna: Yeah, sanitise, bleach. Stain remove. We did all that, it’s just a really long time ago, you’ve forgotten.

Vicki: And it was very quick, a very quick process.

Vashti: But to stop it happening again, you need to make sure that your nappies are washed regularly. So don’t leave them any more than two days. Keep them well ventilated, so have your dry pail where there’s lots of air flow around it.

Jenna: In Brisbane, we are muggy, and it’s, 36, 37 degrees it’s going to get up to today.

Vicki: It’s the humidity. And Darwin and further north…

Jenna: Ventilation, ventilation, ventilation.

Vashti: Lots and lots of air flow. I used a wet bag, when I was in Victoria I was able to use a bucket in my laundry sink. It was no dramas, I left the lid off and everything like that. But when I moved back to Brisbane, we kept having mould issues, even though it was in that well-ventilated bucket and everything. Moved to a wet bag, a wet bag worked for me because I had it hanging and there was air flow around the wet bag. The one day I left the wet bag sitting on the floor because I forgot to hang it up, and I was busy, I got mould in my nappies because there was no ventilation around the bottom.

Jenna: Are we talking a wet bag with holes, like a netted one?

Vashti: No, no, just a normal wet bag.

Jenna: Really? That’s interesting.

Vashti: So that worked for me. It doesn’t work for everyone. A lot of people prefer a wire basket or a plastic basket with lots of holes around it.

Jenna: It’s interesting, all these tiny little variances because when we talk about nappies and stuff, we’re talking about such, it’s not clinical. Nothing in the house is clinical. To the point where, and you don’t know everything about everyone’s system. Whether it’s hanging up, whether it’s on the floor, that made a difference. Even, I have an incredibly well ventilated basket. I have a wire basket. It’s all holes. But, I have a European laundry. With the doors that close. I have to have them open. If I close them because we’re having people around or something like that, at the end of the day, that laundry smells. If I keep them open all the time, I don’t get any smells. So that’s what I, you cannot, when people are asking for advice online, you can’t know every tiny little variant, so it does depend on what works for you, and you’ve got to do a little bit of trial and error sometimes.

Vicki: Does that answer your question?

Jenna: He doesn’t even know what the question was anymore.

Andrew: Does that cover mould?

Jenna: Yes.

Vashti: I think so. And if it doesn’t, pop a note in the comments and we’ll answer it.

Andrew: That’s right, because we’ll do this again sometime. How to fix… people telling you how to do everything. Like a podcast?

Jenna: Don’t listen to anyone, ever.

Vashti: Do what works for you. If you are struggling, contact your local nappy retailer or manufacturer or wherever you bought your nappies from and ask some advice, and take that advice with a grain of salt. I mean, Vicki and I have been doing this for years. We have a really good understanding of cloth nappies and stuff like that, and can give you all the best advice. But we still say, how you use that advice is up to you. So you can mould that advice to fit your circumstances.

Vicki: And for the love of everything cloth, don’t ever apologise for using disposables.

Vashti: Gosh, no.

Vicki: If you need a break, take a break. Nobody is going to judge. I just have the theory that if I’m not there changing a baby, waking up in the middle of the night, feeding your baby…

Vashti: Washing your clothes.

Vicki: …playing with your baby, washing your… my opinion means nothing. And that goes for absolutely everybody on the internet that is giving you a hard time. Forget it. Forget it.

Jenna: Vicki said this to me once when Ryan was younger. It wasn’t about cloth, it was about the fact that we get up, and the first thing we do is watch TV. And I was having guilt about it and stuff. And Vicki was like, sorry, filtering out the swear words, screw them.

Andrew: That’s my job, I do that.

Jenna: OK, [beep] them. Beep those people. And Vicki basically said, unless they are around parenting, because Ryan is an early waker, if they are parenting your kid at 5:00 in the morning, they get an opinion. As long as they are not over at your house parenting your kid at 5:00 in the morning, they do not get an opinion.

Vicki: They don’t get a say.

Jenna: You do what you need to do. The other thing that I’ll say is I get very…

Vicki: My kid is currently at home, on his iPad and he’s probably been on, he’ll be getting close to his screen time, which is five hours for the day. So I can do a podcast. So be it.

Jenna: I have a seven month old and a three and a half year old. And guess what, Ryan’s screen time is, how much will you have, sweetheart? I had a migraine on Tuesday and I could not get him, I was like, please just sit and watch your iPad. I was begging him, and of course that was the day he didn’t feel like doing that. Back to dealing with people who tell you how to do everything. One thing that Vicki warned me about, I don’t like confrontation. I don’t deal with it well, I freeze up and I get nervous.

Vicki: You do it really well with me though.

Jenna: I must love you.

Andrew: That’s because she feel safe around you.

Jenna: I find having some freezes worked out is a really good way to deal with that. So saying things like, well this is what works for me. This is what we’ve chosen. When I was pregnant, I had people telling me not to do cloth, and it was hard, because when you’re pregnant, you don’t know yet, you’re not there yet. So I would just say, we’re going to give it a go. We’re going to give it a go. So no matter what people would say, we’re going to give it a go. That way I didn’t have to fight with them, it was not a hill I had to die on. But just, we’ll give it a go. Whatever phrase works for you. And the other thing I will say, especially when you’re dealing with grandparents opinions, is be informed. Things have changed since our grandparents day. Both the nappies and the detergents. Napisan no longer sanitises things the way it used to. It’s a different formula. So when they’re telling you to do that, you can explain to them, Napisan isn’t what it was in their day, so it doesn’t work the same way. When they’re talking about how to clean nappies, they didn’t deal with bamboo, which is a very delicate fibre, and they didn’t deal with elastics and everything the same way we do. So explaining to them, being informed and explaining to them, and let’s be fair, some mums will listen. And some won’t. I told my Grandma over and over again that I would not be boiling them on a, what’s it called? A copper. And yet, every time I spoke to her, she told me about the copper and how hard doing the nappies would be. Some people won’t listen.

Vicki: And you know what, there’s a great phrase that I use with the kids. Asked and answered. I tell you what, that shuts down a conversation pretty damn quick.

Jenna: I’ll have to use it.

Vicki: It works with kids too, especially when they’ve asked, can I have this app? Can I have this app? Asked and answered.

Jenna: Mum used to just scream at me, you broke my vagina to end conversation. It won’t work for me. You broke my stomach. That’ll work.

Vicki: Do you want to see the scar you left?

Jenna: Yes, do that.

Vicki: They’ll be running.

Andrew: This top one is yours.

Jenna: My Mum used to do that to end conversations when I was a teenager, because I’d be like eh, and just run away. She’s genius. They also used to, if they wanted the TV, turn around and say, want a tonguie, lovey? Just to scare the crap out of us and we’d run out and they’d have the TV to themselves.

Vicki: Actually, we do that. Andrew and I do that. Abby can’t stand when we kiss. Arabella likes it, and Gabe just looks…

Jenna: God forbid our parents be in love.

Vicki: I know. And Gabriel just looks at us and goes, oh, I love that.

Vashti: He’ll change.

Jenna: Gabe is so sweet. He came over the other day and he was like…

Vicki: He wants you to actually be his, he wants to come over every day. And play with you.

Jenna: He can come over and play. He was so sweet, he was showing me all these 3D objects he’d made, and I was like, come upstairs, you will die when you see our Connetix. And he came upstairs and he was playing with Ryan’s Connetix. All three of your kids were, actually.

Andrew: Abby wasn’t there.

Jenna: I thought Abby was there?

Andrew: No, Abby wasn’t there.

Jenna: I just counted an imaginary kid.

Andrew: You were probably counting your own kid in that number. It was just Arabella and Gabriel.

Jenna: Yeah, I was like, Andrew hold this.

Andrew: Because remember I had to leave when Abby rang me and said, I have to go to work?

Jenna: Yes, I remember now. Three kids. Liam wasn’t playing. I handed Liam to Andrew. Here, hold this.

Vicki: No, Gabe had the best time. He kind of wanted you to be his teacher.

Jenna: Oh hell no, I had so many people who were like, you should open a family day care. And I’m like, I barely like my own kids. No.

Andrew: I’ll say what I say to everybody who’s thinking about starting a business. Read The E-Myth.

Jenna: Andrew’s been telling about that.

Andrew: I think that will do, guys.

Vicki: OK, sounds good.

Andrew: Thank you, Vicki.

Vicki: Thanks, Andrew.

Andrew: Thanks, Vashti.

Vashti: Thanks, Andrew.

Andrew: What’s your name? Oh, Jenna. Thanks, Jenna.

Jenna: The other one.

Andrew: Not-Vicki.

Jenna: I’ll take not-Vicki.

Vashti: The work wife.

Andrew: Bye everybody.


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